SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

And before anyone says it. We did go through STI testing and all clear.

You have just described the majority of cheaters. A slippery slope, a friendship, a person saying they loved, all came together to make an affair. Your wife does not sound like a bad person. She sounds like her life at work became more important than her life at home. There are no dishes to cook and clean, no toilets to scrub, no finances to balance, no bills to pay. It is the adult version of fairyland. A mythical, mystical place where everything is so intense and dense no sunlight(common sense) gets in.
If she is truly dedicated she will put in the work. You should not.
I follow 1stwife because she put up with two affairs and a threat of divorce. One day she hit a wall and was done. She not only didn’t beg, or fall apart, she decided divorce was her choice and spent months planning it. Reality hit her husband in the face and he took on the responsibility to fix himself. That is where your wife should be. You have carried the burden of grief long enough.

See my tagline? I truly believe in it. I believe we have a lot to say in our own happiness.
By happiness I’m not referring to roses and unicorns. Not an endless feast of whiskey and ice-cream. I don’t think the Greek Stoics were referring to that sort of happiness. It’s more that when you reflect on your life you are content.

You can’t make your wife stop the affair, or make her want the marriage. You can’t make the OM leave her alone or prevent her from seeking his company. What you can control is yourself.

Inaction is action. Doing nothing is a decision.
You didn’t go search for a site like this one and post your story because you are content with your situation. You are unhappy. It’s now your call if you remain unhappy.

I’m not so naïve as to think you can reach one single decision that will automatically make you happy. But you can reach a decision that you are more content with. That in turn changes your situation, and with time you can chose options from your new viewpoint/stance that move you even closer to happiness/content.

We can only see from what you share what your stance is. To us – it sounds very passive.
We could be completely off base, but the way it reads to us is like she had an affair and you simply told her that she needs to decide if she wants to have the affair or not. In the meantime, it doesn’t sound like you are taking any action – leaving the whole decision in her hands.

What we are suggesting in not that you lock her up, or place a monitoring collar on her. I personally think the first part of your line-of-thought is the correct one. Where you accept that she needs to decide what she wants.

There is immense power in a statement like:
"I think we could work things out and reconcile from this affair. However, I’m not forcing you to anything. What I will state is that I refuse to share you. You are totally free to be with him or any other person, but not as my wife. I encourage you to look realistically at what a divorce would be. We would both come out OK and we can change our relationship into a good coparenting role if that’s how this develops.
What is important to understand is that I won’t wait for long. Until I am convinced that you are placing effort into our marriage, I am assuming you have chosen him, and I will proceed at my pace towards getting out of infidelity".

On another matter: If you are so convinced that the OM made the phone-call to claim his possession over your wife, then you would be naïve to think he’s out of the picture. If he was willing to go to that desperate length then he’s going to be doing his best to contact her. I would be concerned if she claims he isn’t, and more comforted in knowing he was, and what actions she takes to keep him at a distance.

Thank you Bigger,

I've certainty not been passive. I can only control myself has been almost my mantra throughout.

I've told her multiple times that I am willing to try as I'd regret not. She knows I dont have any hate or anger for her. I do however have anger that I am left to suffer the consequences and this she knows too.

I will fight tooth and nail for our happiness. Both mine and hers. And this has been made clear.

It came to a head last week. She offered to leave and thought that was for the best. I agreed. I didnt want to but without commitment to trying or making a decision there was no other choice.

What happened next took us both by surprise. I did something embarrassingly silly in public while taking our youngest to a club. I figured she could do with a smile and a laugh so I sent her messages about it building up a punch line at my expense almost. Its what weve always done with each other.

My daughter was at home with her and witnessed the effect. She said it looked like my wife was going insane. She laughed and cried and just circled. It was her tipping point. She realised what she was about to lose and what she had done.

Since then she has taken full account of her actions. Taking actions to ease my mistrust. Told me about messages from him and sent one final message back telling him to not contact her again and they are through forever. She has not blocked him as she wants to be able to tell him to stay away from events like one we have this weekend that involves people they both know.

At counselling she has accepted full responsibility and asked what she can do to help us heal.

She has opened up to friends of us both and our eldest also knows what has happened (she figured it out) and has had a long conversation with her about everything and explained what we are working towards together now.

At no point did I do anything out of my character. I didnt ignore her or try to make her feel bad. I just gave the same level of love I always have. I held her while she cried over ending a long friendship and treated her in exactly the same way I would any friend whos hurting.
I did not want to use tools or tricks or anything to win her back or make her do anything. All I could do was be myself and trust in that. I was certainly we were through and divorce was the only option and id accepted that happy that I'd not given up or been untrue to myself and my values.

There have been very positive differences following. She keeps saying how lucky she is to have me. She has become, we have become better at speaking about how we feel both good and bad. "I'm fine" is not allowed.

I wont be checking her phone or tracking her. I will trust in us and the knowledge of what will be lost from any slip. She knows I cant make myself trust her. Even tonight. She is out for drinks with people from her work. She called to say and had someone I do trust and who knows what has happened with her saying they will drop her home after. I haven't asked her to do that and I wouldnt tell her she cant go out. But she knows that by involving her colleague who I do trust it puts my mind at ease.

I guess what I'm saying is we're doing OK and heading in the right direction. The counsellor today exclaimed she has not seen a response like ours ever. And has great confidence in everything we are doing.

Still a long way to go. But we are walking that road hand in hand now with honesty and care.

You remind me a lot of me in how you are responding to your wife's A.

I'm not telling you that you are making a mistake, and I get the feeling there would be little to no way to get you to adjust your path.

You still have a bunch of hard lessons to learn that you are going to simply have to learn first hand. The first is that no contact is *no* contact. Your wife is not NC with her AP. As such the A is ongoing. It's maybe in hibernation or on a hiatus now. She almost certainly will break NC without real NC in place.

I did not want to use tools or tricks or anything to win her back or make her do anything.

You are on an uneven playing field of your wife's making. You are still in an informational war with her and you are giving her the upper hand. I know it's nearly impossible to think of your wife as the enemy, but that's basically where you are right now. Tricks and lies are 100% on the table for her. So careful how you decide to tie your hands by not using "tools or tricks". I had an extremely similar outlook on this. That what I need was her to make the authentic choice of ending the A and being with me and recognizing her wrongs.

What you are going to get is going to fall way short of what you want. The reason for that is quite simple. A person that is still wayward will choose both as long as both is even close to a viable option. You are the only one that can change that.

I might suggest you are at least a little in denial. You should be angry as hell at her. You deserve to be angry. She has betrayed you. She has committed an ethical violation that is historically second only to murder regardless of what we have decided as a society legally.

What books are your reading?

Is there an "other betrayed spouse"?

I read your story in your bio, and my take is this:

Despite what you say about not wanting to control her, and wanting her to make decisions, what you are doing is the "pick me dance" writ large. You are not taking the right steps to end the A. You are leaving yourself in a vulnerable position. You are not quite blaming yourself, but you are in some way under the impression that perhaps if you had been a better husband she would have been happy and wouldn't have cheated. That type of thinking gives us comfort because we think "If I do the right things, I will get the right outcome". The reality is that you have even less control over this than you think and that you are purporting to "not control her". What you are doing is refusing to take certain actions that you categorize as controlling. What you are doing is making wishful magical thinking, that if you just put in the good boy effort you will get the good boy reward.

That just not how it's going to work and my heart goes out to you. It really does. Your journey has barely started and you are putting yourself in a tough position from the outset.

This0is0Fine is absolutely right, and sadly, also most likely right about OP having to learn the hard way. So many do. We tend to think our situation is so unique, and "you don’t know her like I do" thinking, that we ignore battle-tested crowd-sourced wisdom and end up hurting ourselves more.

FWIW OP, we will not rub your nose in it after the hard lesson(s) have been learned. Please come back for help then.

In the beginning of the Dday aftermath I thought if I explode with anger he will Go running to her.

Little did I know that he already planned to D me.

I did just about everything I could think of to reconcile. However often the cheater views the betrayed as weak. And that gives the cheater more control and ability to continue to cheat.

However at dday2 things were very different.

He realized he had gone too far and he lost all power, control or ability to say anything. I was now in complete control. I never told him what to do to get to R — he had to figure that out himself.

But he Sat me down one day and showed me how he was blocking her on every device. Step in the right direction for once.

I didn’t find out about SI until 3 years after dday2 so I didn’t have the wisdom of the people here. I wish I did because I think I could have spared myself from some of the things I endured.

Hope this helps you.

I've never been one to try and control my wife or make choices for her. What I have said very clearly is there is no second chance. If she wants to be with him then go be with him. If she wants to leave then that is fine too. Its her choice.

Respectfully, you are ALREADY giving her a second chance. While this may seem like a trivial detail, I can assure you it is not. Based on the way you have phrased your previous thought process, I would guess that you also made it clear to her in the past that infidelity is a deal breaker for you. And yet, here you are.

Your actions have already communicated that your words are not what you actually mean.

I get it...the view is easy from the cheap seats, and I am not suggesting you rush out and divorce right now.

But what I am saying is you need to choose your words carefully, and FFS, when you say something, mean it. Really mean it. Make your actions match your words, even if it means you have to end things.

Thank you all for your thoughts and advice.

We are doing well. We just got back from a mini break just the two of us that she planned.

I honestly did think an affair would be game over and I'd walk away. When I found out I quickly realised thats not how I wanted to be.
So I from that moment gave us a chance. The second chance will not happen. Ive been extremely clear that now I know how I feel and what pain it causes I will not suffer the consequences again.
As backup our eldest knows what happened too and there is no chance in hell they will forgive if the affair starts up again.

My wife has been open about receiving messages from him pleading and has ignored them or responded to leave her alone. Shes not blocked them yet because she is worried they will start contacting people who she works with or use social media to tell the world about the affair.
We talked it through and for her sanity as long as she is open about everything he sends and her attitude towards him stays the same I'm not pressing her to block him. From what it looks like he is digging himself a hole and she is loathing him more and more.

It is still tough though and she knows that. My trust is low for her and without asking she is making little steps like calling me when she is at lunch at work for whatever reason and saying who she is with and they always say hi as I know them all well.

When we are in bed together it is really good until its not. Ive found that intrusive thoughts on what has happened can absolutly kill the mood from me and when it does as a man its fairly obvious. But she knows why and this really really upsets her that she did that and her actions put those intrusive thoughts there. Its only happened a couple of times and we've talked about it. She cried the first time from disgust at her actions.

I do think that what we have is special and worth fighting for. But I am no fool and will not be taken for one and she knows that.

The "pick me dance" gets mentioned a lot and honestly I dismiss it. Of course i wanted her to pick me otherwise I'd be packing her bags. But there was no dance to it or any weakness. I said what i wanted but was happy for her to decide otherwise. I can afford our house and kids myself and I am capable of doing this by myself. I said if she'd be happier with him then go right ahead several times and at no point was it a bluff. What I did do for me and the kids was start doing everything for me and them.

I didnt ignore her though. I treated her in exactly the same way I would a friend and that was that. It was her desicion to make the first move closer and her desicion to share everything. She decided what she could do to ease the paranioa. It was me though who made it clear after we got closer that I was taking a huge risk and there would be no more chances if she hurt me again. So to make certain this is what she actually wants. If she wanted to walk away at that point then that would have been absolutly fine.

Shes worked hard to make it clear I am her choice. That and her clear disdain for her former partner and grief over what she did gives me a sense of security but my guard is still up.

I'll update in a few months with where we are then.

It is not "paranoia". It's hyper vigilance. Paranoia is *irrational* distrust. Your wife betrayed you and you are responding to that. That she is behaving in a manner that consists of "transference of vigilance" is definitely positive.

I know you are dismissing the "pick me dance" stuff. I did too. I said, "no I'm not doing that", yet, in reality I basically was because, like you, I didn't enforce true NC. This is a fundamental step in getting out of infidelity. Even if you think she is starting to hate him, she is thinking about him. He is part of her life. The line between hate and fucking is really thin, especially for an AP. Recall that part of the intensity felt in the affair is the illicit nature of it. She is continuing to get illicit attention, even if you think he is "digging himself a hole".

No contact is no contact. Until then the A is ongoing.

I'll ask again about books you might be using on your journey. Is it on the list below?

Good ones:

Not Just Friends

How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair

Mediocre Ones:

After the Affair

How to Build Trust and Avoid Betrayal

Bad ones:

Mating in Captivity

State of Affairs

Just slogging at it alone without a guide book?

[This message edited by This0is0Fine at 7:38 PM, Thursday, July 3rd]

I like hyper vigilance. Sounds a lot better than paranioa.

I've not read any books. We are seeing a very good counsellor though.

We got lucky with who we got, she isn't just an everyday covers all counsellor. She is a lecturer who specialises in couples and teaches others as her main job.

I've had counseling before and this lady is very different and talks through with us without bias or being flimsy.

She has said very similar. NC is important but she agreed it has to be my wifes choice otherwise there is a good chance it will fail.

When my wife talks about her AP, the counsellor has pointed out aspects of his behaviour that are extremely manipulative but managed to do so in a way that wasn't negative. Just enough to start my wife seeing him in a new light.

What she did say at the end of our last session was that up until then it felt like there needed to be an extra seat out for the AP in the room but now it feels like he is not welcome.

She has also given us some really good advice very similar to yours. About the excitement of an affair and that has little to do with feelings. Her advice was to make our own excitement and she gave a few suggestions which we had already started doing so that was positive.

She also talked a lot about boundaries and mine was while I agree the NC is on her terms my boundary is meeting up in person or not telling me about messages he sends.

The counsellor pointed out subtlety that as I had found out not just what but who before it came out, now I know it will be very likely that should the boundary be broken i would know and that would be the end. She fully believed my commitment to that.

So not entirely blind, and I'd much rather the assistance of a counselor like ours who can bend with the situation than a book which by its nature is rigid.

On the NC. My wifes best friend who is my oldest friend and the person who introduced us all those years ago knows everything and is very much on my wifes back about NC. She is superb and very blunt. Shes got my wife to show her the messages every time shes seen her and has said so why haven't you blocked him yet then.
And this is someone I trust absolutly and should there be anything she feels is off I know and my wife knows she will tell me.

Right now though everything is heading in the right direction. One of my favourite positive moments was a week ago, we went to a friend's wedding and had a great time. We were there from 6am helping set up and I'd done all the music for the ceremony and dinner and included our own first dance song in that.
But what really struck me was the vows. My wife said to me after she now understood why I'm not wearing my ring as she'd broken our vows. She looked me in the eye and said when we are ready she would like to renew our vows in a small ceremony and it doesnt need to be anything big she just wants us to get to where she can say them again and I believe them. Shes mentioned it a few times since and has talked to our eldest about it with full acknowledgement that it can only be when shes proven herself worthy of them.

Its the little things like that that give me hope for our future.

Shes got my wife to show her the messages every time shes seen her and has said so why haven't you blocked him yet then.

Yup, why has the AP not been blocked?

Shes not blocked them yet because she is worried they will start contacting people who she works with or use social media to tell the world about the affair.

Are you seriously buying this ridiculous excuse?

I'll update in a few months with where we are then.

If you don't set some clear non-negotiable conditions like immediately blocking AP, I'm afraid your next updates will be a little less cheerful.

Is the OM married? In a relationship? If so, tell the wife or girlfriend immediately what’s going on. It was only when I disclosed what was going on to OM’s wife that things really stopped and reality finally broke in. This guy’s fantasy land and pursuit of your wife will end rather quickly in the glaring light of a jealous spouse or girlfriend.

Hey OP,

I don't post much these days, but regularly pop in to see how people are doing. My advice is usually not as good as some of the other members, so I read more than I post. This site has literally saved my sanity. I read your bio. Very comprehensive. You might want to pop it into AI and create a TLDR version for the phone crowd. Just a suggestion.

There's much in your thread to address. First. Your WW is not unique and neither is her A. Just a run of the mill cheater. There is a reason that some of the wiser, more experienced members here are cautioning you about your reactions. Trust me, I was resistant in my early days. Heck, even with my last relationship, I had blind spots.

Next. There is a world of difference between seems and is. Right now,you are in shock and your WW is love bombing you. It is a conscious,subconscious effort to control the situation. Most couples will engage in hysterical bonding during the early stages. We did, and even though I found my WW physically repulsive, we screwed like rabbits. The human mind is full of contradictions...

Now, healing is nonlinear. How you feel today is not how you will feel tomorrow. And then it loops back. I hated that part, but on the whole, I moved forward, but only by inches. Read the threads of others so you can learn what to expect. I found it helped me know I was not alone in my experience.

This concerned me:

My wife has been open about receiving messages from him pleading and has ignored them or responded to leave her alone. Shes not blocked them yet because she is worried they will start contacting people who she works with or use social media to tell the world about the affair.

Your WW is not the woman you fell in love with and married. That was a fictional construct. We all make them and when they shatter, it can be terrifying. IMHO, from your posts, you seem to want to see her in the best possible light and give her every grace, but you need to step back and look at her objectively. That's where this place comes in handy. I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest the reason she has not blocked her AP is that she doesn't actually want to. Just imagine how much of an ego boost it is to have two men fighting over you! Every time he messages her she gets a dopamine hit from the validation. How long before she resumes the A? It's like being an alcoholic and working as a bartender. Too risky. No contact means no contact.

One of the things I started doing after my M ended was keep a notebook where I wrote about how people I my life conducted themselves with me. I called it my red flag file. I recognized that I have a tendency to see the best in people and thus overlook bad behaviour to my own detriment. I kept the entries objective and factual. What it did was give me the ability to see patterns in how people acted and thus make objective assessments. I could see trends over time and it became my external extra lobe, helpi g me process. You might want to try this.

Your posts seem very calm, so I'm guessing the anger phaze hasn't hit yet. It's coming. That one was super fun for me... sheesh. Just know that this place is filled with very caring members who have walked the path and survived. Good luck. Hoping you find your way.

[This message edited by Justsomeguy at 5:03 PM, Sunday, July 6th]

I truly hope you two are on a path to genuine recovery and find the happiness you both deserve. What I'm about to share comes from a place of deep concern and a desire for you to navigate this with clarity and self-protection.

Everything I've learned about successful affair recovery suggests this is a disaster waiting to happen, and I urge you to reconsider your tactics. You've mentioned a low level of trust, yet you're choosing not to track her actions or monitor her phone. How can trust truly rebuild in a vacuum of passive hope, with no tangible evidence to support her words? Are you prepared to live in a state of perpetual unknowing for years, wishing trust will magically reappear? This approach, frankly, doesn't seem sustainable for your peace of mind.

Furthermore, an affair of the magnitude you've described—a year-plus physical relationship—cannot simply be cut out with the ease she's portraying. Your current level of trust, or lack thereof, suggests you might be far too trusting given the significant betrayal you've endured. I genuinely fear a second D-Day might be looming. Her rationale for not blocking him makes no logical sense if you scrutinize it for a moment. Is she truly arguing that allowing him to send texts, as long as she doesn't respond, will prevent him from contacting others about the affair, while a definitive block would provoke him? That seems entirely irrational.

It appears you might be viewing your circumstance as unique, somehow exempt from the typical dynamics of infidelity. Let me tell you, the specifics you've outlined, both about the affair itself and your wife's subsequent behavior, are tragically textbook. The only truly uncommon element here seems to be your reaction to it.

It's difficult not to conclude that her reluctance to block him stems from a desire for this situation to quiet down so she can potentially slide back into that "extra side sex and ego boost." Perhaps, if you maintain this lack of monitoring, you might never truly discover it. This leads to a crucial, uncomfortable question: are you, perhaps subconsciously, aspiring to "ignorance is bliss"? Spouses monitor their unfaithful partners precisely because their words, as demonstrated by over a year of physical deception, simply cannot be trusted.

Beyond this, successful reconciliation is rarely, if ever, achieved without strong boundaries and clear, tangible consequences for the unfaithful partner. Unless omitted from your account, I don't see any significant consequences she has faced for her affair. While you've clearly stated you'll divorce her if she breaks no contact again, what genuine evidence has she been given to believe this will actually happen? If anything, if you previously declared cheating a deal-breaker and yet here you are—your actions, from her perspective, already contradict your words. She has no compelling reason to believe you won't be equally flexible a second time, especially if it's framed as mere texting for "closure." Be warned: unchecked "closure" often escalates back into sexual intimacy.

After discovering a year-long affair, she has, by all accounts, been largely coddled. I cannot fathom how this reaction could possibly initiate true change in someone with a broken moral compass, genuinely increase their respect for you, or prevent them from repeating the behavior. People—and by that, I mean specifically cheaters—need consequences to instigate change. If their inherent morality or respect for their partner were sufficient to deter them, they would never have cheated in the first place. I urge you to outline what specific, meaningful consequences you believe she has faced that would genuinely prevent a recurrence. I think one of your children and close friends knowing is a good first step.

It is rare for me to suggest embracing anger, as it's often a destructive force. However, in your situation, anger can be your friend; it can be the correct and necessary reaction to a profound betrayal. You need to fully articulate your pain, clearly state why her actions are utterly disgusting, and firmly place the onus on her to explain precisely what she is going to do to rectify this situation and earn back a shred of your trust. She needs to provide compelling reasons why you should stay, and robust assurances of how she will prevent a repeat of this behavior. Ask yourself: Why shouldn't you go off and have a year of fun? How would she truly feel if you did?

On top of all this, I strongly urge you to impose meaningful consequences. This could involve having her reveal what she's done to her parents or yours. Some, perhaps controversially, suggest a "hall pass" (regardless of whether you'd use it) as a means for her to truly internalize the pain by contemplating your intimacy with another. Insist she changes jobs if the affair partner was a colleague. Have her stay in a separate room for an extended period, or even move in with a relative if feasible. Do something that unequivocally displays you haven't just rolled over.

I apologize if this reads as "doom and gloom," but there's a profound reason why typical, hard-line advice aligns the way it does in these situations. Your current approach, as I perceive it, appears to be: "Okay, you enjoyed a consequence-free year of sex with another man. Just promise you won't do it again, and we'll rebuild, even though I won't verify if you're truly upholding that promise."

All of this doesn't even begin to address why you seem to doubt your own inherent worthiness of the loyalty your marriage vows proclaimed. I fear this is a deeper, unaddressed issue. This entire situation reads as if you are far too willing to believe your wife is somehow "owed" a year-long sexual affair. Or alternatively that you aren't owed the loyalty you vowed to. I highly suspect that individual counseling, specifically addressing your self-perception and value, is required for your long-term healing. Perhaps this can be looked at further down the line. Alternatively, perhaps critical elements of your marriage and your reactions have been omitted from your post that would explain this dynamic.

In summary, it appears you might be believing your core perspective of your partner doesn't need to fundamentally shift. While I acknowledge that maintaining a stable perspective can seem comforting, I believe you might be missing a crucial point that is vital for genuine healing and a truly secure future.

Your perspective of her must change. This isn't a punitive measure; it's a necessary acknowledgment of a painful reality. You likely never imagined she was capable of this. Yet, she has. This stark contradiction between who you thought she was and what she has done necessitates a fundamental re-evaluation of your understanding of her and, consequently, how you interact with her.

If you're unwilling or unable to embrace this shift in perspective, to truly acknowledge the wrong that was committed and its implications, I fear you may inadvertently set yourselves up for more pain down the line. The goal isn't just to achieve "reconciliation" as an end in itself, but to build a truly happy and faithful marriage – one that is resilient, honest, and untainted by unaddressed issues. This means confronting the reality of the betrayal directly and allowing it to inform a new, more realistic foundation for your relationship, rather than passively hoping for a return to a pre-betrayal state that no longer exists.

I truly wish you all the best and hope for a positive outcome for you, whatever form it takes. I hope I am wrong in my assessment, but unless key facts are omitted from this post or it's merely a tonal issue in how you've presented it, I struggle to see a different conclusion.

Also, fellow UK resident! Apologies if any of this seems harsh. I promise I'm trying to help.

[This message edited by DRSOOLERS at 10:02 AM, Monday, July 7th]

She looked me in the eye and said when we are ready she would like to renew our vows in a small ceremony and it doesnt need to be anything big she just wants us to get to where she can say them again and I believe them.

I’m sorry, but someone who isn’t fighting tooth & nail for you & the marriage she cratered should not get to make a statement like this. Maybe this is too forward, but this made my stomach twist.